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Discussion Starter #1
Here we go again!!

The new clutch is about 5 weeks old now, and starting to fly, a few already do.

I would like the community's help in determining the mutation of these 5 babies.


https://www.dropbox.com/sh/tce4mkafaxrfw9v/yJmkIU6bo0

the link above will direct you to their album.


As hatch-lings, there were 2 that stood out with grey/white down. Now that they are mostly feathered out, I can only see one obvious indication of a pastel. Would you please help me in determining each babies full mutation?

these are their parents:

father: normal grey split to pied and whiteface

mother 1: lutino split to pied (because Gucci whom we thought was a male pied started laying eggs)

mother 2: pastel


Thanks all!
 

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I think you might need Srtiels to take a look at the cinnamon pastels. Do you have a good photo of the adult birds? The pastel face looks almost like a SFDS cinnamon pastel to me. The darker birds are normal possibly split pied, normal light pied and normal split pied.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yea, the pastel threw me off completely with the silver feathering. I've included a few old shots of the parents in the same album. you can ignore the whiteface in the picture of the 4.

and if you look at the pictures of the babies in my palm, the 1st and 3rd picture from left to right are of 2 different babies, yet... as they feathered out, I lost track of which is which. I disappeared for a week without checking the nest box because I was away for work. When I returned, the only noticeable difference was baby 1 (being the largest) and baby 5 (was not stunted but wasn't growing as fast as the others)

What I clearly remember about the hatch-ling is:

baby 1 = yellow down
baby 2 = grey/white down
baby 3 = grey/white down
baby 4 = yellow down
baby 5 = lighter yellow than normal


I'll try to take better close-ups of the parents tomorrow.

How does a SFDS come about? What specific mutations are required?

Appreciate the input Dreamcatchers
 

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SFDS means single factor dominant silver - the bird has a single gene for dominant silver, and must have received the gene from one parent. Since it's a dominant gene you would expect the parent to be visual DS.

Per Susanne at http://talkcockatiels.com/showthread.php?t=8528 : "A DS will have diluted centers to the wing flights with a very fine darker color almost black to the edging of the flight feathers."

It's possible that dad is split cinnamon and this baby is female.
 

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Hmm, well, the parents don't look like DS so that rules out the possibility of silver. Could be cinnamon but that's the oddest cinnamon I have ever seen.
 

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You have a very lovely Pastelface Single Factor Dominant Silver (PF SFDS/pd) split to pied. Look at the feet, they are two toned. That is another indication of a bird carrying the pied gene. When pied is combined with Dominant Silver it makes it harder to truly Identify what mutation it is. If the pied was not in the genetic makeup the beak and feet would be solid black. The wing flight feathers would have had a distinct dark edging and the center of the flight feathers would be dilute/faded looking. Still it is a nice baby.

since the baby is a PF....the PF hen would be the mother. She may also be a very, very, dark toned SFDS, that passes on light genes. Dark toned SFDS Hens rarely look like DS, and are sold as normals, and someone like you reaps the rewards with beautiful surprises in the nest :)
 

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Discussion Starter #7
WOW! Thank you all for responding. And yet again, thank you srtiels for the detailed explanation!

You are right srtiels! This clutch especially, has given me quite the variety and it's so much fun getting surprises!!!

Would this PF SFDS/pd be a boy or girl? Since it's not cinnamon, it wouldn't be sex-linked. Is there a specific way to tell or just the usual wing spots, and male behaviors to distinguish? What would be a good mutation to pair in the future?


Also, out of the five babies, would you be able to tell which one of them is the other pastel face or whiteface? If you look at the pictures of me holding each in my palm. picture 1 and 3, from left to right, those are of 2 different babies, and they both had indications of being PF or WF....
 

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Srtiels will tell you to avoid pairing the silvers to cinnamon, lutino, pied or pearl so that you can enhance the silver color and you do not lose the distinctive markings of the silver. Pied, pearl and cinnamon all mask the silver. I am working with silvers now and this is the advice she has given me on several occasions. :) You can breed to a nice big normal with bright cheekpatches for good splits to enhance the pastel in future generations or you can pair with a solid WF to produce nice visual pastels.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Great info to know! Thanks Dreamcatchers.

I already have Louie, who is pictured below, and was already planning to pair him up with a WF. Unfortunately, the WF I recently got is starting to show signs of being a male :confused:

I'll have to see what this little one turn out to be, whether male or female.


Hoping srtiels will have some clues to the last part of my previous post...
 

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